I would ask the writer's of DA III to have Hawke play a major role, here is why: At the very beginning of DA II when Verric is being questioned by Cassandra, she says "he/she may be the only one who can fix it before it goes to far, he/she is someone that the Mages/Templars respect". So I would say according to DA II's writers that Hawke has to play a major role for this reason. Or are the Lead writers going to say we never said this, so David Gaider, Mike Laidlaw, Mark Darr, and Jennifer Helper, I hope you read this and understand that future game sale depend on how well you follow your own story-line. What does anyone else think?--Charlie.look (talk) 09:23, August 16, 2012 (UTC)
- Mike Laidlaw is not one of the writers, DAII would have been catastrophically worse had Laidlaw taken part in any of the 'writing'. That said, originally Hawke was planned to be the central figure in possible DA sequels but given how the character didn't receive the sort of reaction from fans that the developers wanted (they basically wanted a swords 'n sorcery Commander Shep) they decided to go in a new direction with a new character. Whilst a lot of people might like Hawke (I don't) a lot of other people reacted to the character negatively. With Hawke players were limited to just the one race which is quite the transition from Origins. Also Hawke's story kinda sucked. He/she wasn't the "central, most important person in the Dragon Age universe" that we were led to believe. Hawke just threw oil onto some already burning fires and stood around either being diplomatic, snarky or aggressive. The Warden literally saved the world, Hawke just witnessed a big dint being put into it. So, in short, I do not think Hawke should be the PC in the next game. Whilst I do feel like Hawke does deserve an ending for the Hawke fans out there, I'm certainly not holding out for one. (DDragonfly1990 (talk) 09:43, August 16, 2012 (UTC))
I don't feel one line of dialog from a minor character in DAII would prove your point of Hawke MUST be a major role. As was previously stated, they had plans for Hawke, the dialog likely reflected that, but with any franchise you can't really predict success. Were I you, I'd come up with a better argument other than, "Because Cassandra said so.." She's obviously grasping at straws, and as the chantry is on the brink of destruction, she was likely looking for ANY possible way to try and end the war quicker.
Realistically speaking, Anders was a sneeze away from insanity from the start of that game... had Hawke not even shown up, it would have been a matter of time before he blew up a chantry.. and then Cassandra would have been looking for HIM instead.
I dont hate Hawke, I thought he was a rather interesting character, and as I played a mage I was happy to see the Amell line continued in some fashion... but he wasnt really anyone special. Warden Mage: Ferris (talk) 10:12, August 16, 2012 (UTC)
Like others, I would disagree. And it's nothing against Hawke as a character. Personally I thought he was a good guy, just not interesting and not really important. But given the reception he, and the game itself, received, the developers are basically forced to remove him as the main PC. It's math at this point for them. They are trying to maximize sales and recoup lost players while also bringing in new ones. Personally I think they should focus on the first, but they'll probably try for more new players this time again. A new PC, and thus a semi-new start----again---is really necessary. They can't afford another DA2 really, and if we get one I expect sales to be atrocious, which would be the end of this series sadly and put Bioware in even more of an untenable situation then they already find themselves in. So change is needed, and Hawke is the easiest change to make really. Sorry man, but it's a business decision really, and it's actually the right call. The Grey Unknown (talk) 11:29, August 16, 2012 (UTC)
Personally I think that Bioware should bring back both Hawke and the Warden, why else would they mention at the end of Dragon Age 2 that they are searching for them both; I think they should bring back both characters and let you choose which one you want to play as. Even if they brought back one of them I'd be happy, it's better than bringing in a new hero. Warden Commander 7. 13:00, August 16th, 2012 (UTC)
I often see the same argument made with bringing the Warden back, but I dont believe its possible... I've never made a video game, nor claim any real knowledge as to the mechanics behind a game. But it seems to me If it WERE easy to bring back the warden they would. Perhaps its just me but whenever a dev is asked if the warden is coming back, they kinda cringe, and just say "well were working on several ideas" and then kinda dodge the question. There are so many different variations, I dont imagine the specifics of YOUR warden are kept in the save data. Again, I could be wrong on that... but it seems more like we will only hear about the warden and hawke from here on out. Personally I'd love to see my warden, even if its just a cameo.. but Im not holding my breath to the idea. Warden Mage: Ferris (talk) 13:52, August 16, 2012 (UTC)
Make him a major companion
- I think that would actually be worse than having Hawke as the PC.--Liam Sionnach (talk) 16:20, August 16, 2012 (UTC)
- Sorry, there are just far too variables to actually make him/her a viable companion. First off, appearence is a major problem. If they have problems importing commander Shepard's face, imagine how hard it would be to import Hawke? Second, his/her personality. He could be snarky, aggressive, or diplomatic. That means you would have to record at least 3 different voice options. Third, the choices from the second game. Having Hawke as an active companion would mean they might need to acknowledge them. it just seems like far too much effort for a dime-store companion. Aleksandr the Great (talk) 17:57, August 16, 2012 (UTC)
I truly understand how people feel about the Character "Hawke", but just like in Dragon Age Origins; which I loved, Bio-Ware seems intent on letting you create a Character, be they the Warden or Hawke, and then as soon as you spend time developing your Character, they reach over and FLUSH the OLD TOILET. I know that its just a Character, but I have found with each different type of Warden and with each New Version of Hawke, he/or she seem to have their own personality. I would also agree that I found being restricted to just playing a human was rather uninteresting. Perhaps that is why I am looking forward to the writers letting us play another race, and when I say another race, I do not mean oh let me be "the Dwarf or the elf". I am hoping that the writers will get creative and either let us play a member of the Qun or Tal-Vashoth. Oh SORRY I forgot the Writers and DAVID GAIDER do not know how to be creative or how to follow a story line properly, well enough bitching about that which we can do nothing about. No I guess we will probably be given the option of playing a Human, or Elf, or Dwarf with a french accent. --Charlie.look (talk) 00:02, August 17, 2012 (UTC)
I agree that Hawke should play a role in DAIII, as I think Hawke and the Warden are linked to the same flow of fate. They are both major players in the events that are to transpire in DAIII, which is why both of them are currently missing. Though, in the case of a male Warden, he could be missing because he romanced Morrigan and went through the eluvian with her. But in the case of my character, Izen Cousland, he is the king of Ferelden, and the fact that he disappeared should not go unnoticed. So considering that the Warden can disappear regardless of whether the Warden is lowly carta or hero king, it means Hawke is also important to whatever the Warden is wrapped up in now. Hawke should be in DAIII, and if playable, then playable as a companion character. It might also be good for Warden to be a companion character with the new DAIII character being the main character. However that might raise the problem of voicing the Warden, so maybe not. Believe it! (talk) 16:28, August 17, 2012 (UTC)
- I think the only thing worse than having Hawke as a companion would be having the Warden as a companion. Leaving aside all the logistical problem of the Warden's various Origins, skills, and which choices they made in DA:O, why would you ever want the Warden taken out of your control and made into a NPC? For me, I'd probably spend the whole game thinking that my Warden should be able to kick the new PC's ass, and also thinking at every moment that my Warden wouldn't say that line, or do whatever action the plot causes him to do. Hell no, I'd rather my Wardens stay mysteriously disappeared than risk them becoming the next Anders (as in drastically changed in character and annoying the hell out of me constantly).--Liam Sionnach (talk) 16:49, August 17, 2012 (UTC)
- I didn't say make the Warden an NPC. I said make the Warden a PC that is a companion. What I would prefer is that they just bring back the Warden and make him/her the main character for ALL DA games. However, Gaider said the Warden's story is over, and if seen again it will be as an NPC. So if we can only see our CC (custom character) from Origins as a companion character, then it's better than seeing him/her as an NPC, and perhaps not seeing the Warden at all. Because let's face it, "mysteriously disappeared" is a cop-out. My character would not just mysteriously disappear, and Ferelden would not rest until he was found. He is king after all, and even though Anora is still there to rule in his absence, she would want him found too seeing as how they are married. And the whole point of having the CC in DAIII would be to have everything from Origins match up. So the Warden would act as designed in Origins. Believe it! (talk) 17:19, August 17, 2012 (UTC)
- I think you and I have different ideas about what an NPC is. Let me clarify my position. In Dragon Age Hawke and the Warden(s) were the PC's of their respective games (and I guess Lelia a in her DLC, and darks pawn guy in his)everyone else is an NPC. Sure we have more influence over the companions hen most NPCs but they can and will do things that we cannot control. I agree, the mysteriously disappeared line is a cop out, but I prefer that to having the Warden taken out of my.control and left in the hands of the writers, lest they be ruined like Anders & Justice. And don't even get me started on what was done with Revan and the Exile. I too would have liked the Warden to continue on as the protagonist of the series, but they've confirmed that they aren't going to do that. So I'd prefer they leave the warden alone rather than risk ruining my character because a writer wants to do something dramatic. (Liam Sionnach)--188.8.131.52 (talk) 21:48, August 17, 2012 (UTC)
- Yeah we probably do have different ideas of what an NPC is. I see it as what it actually is, a "non-playable character" (which is what NPC stands for). The Warden and Hawke were PCs, MCs (main characters), and CCs (custom characters though Hawke to a lesser extent). Alistair, Leliana, Morrigan, Sten, etc. were all PCs. Characters like Eleanor, Jowan & Lily, Daveth & Jory, the guards at Ishal/Circle Mage, Irving, etc. they too are PCs. However, characters like Eamon & Teagan, Bryce & Fergus, Greagoir & Cullen, Avernus & Sophia, those are all NPCs. They are non-playable characters. However, I understand your point about leaving the Warden out of it. Still, that's why I said making the Warden a companion (PC) would be a good compromise. The Warden would be in it again, and the player would have control over the Warden, as opposed to the Warden being an NPC. Believe it! (talk) 19:35, August 21, 2012 (UTC)
- Yeah, I know what NPC stands for, but I stand by my assertion that the companion characters are closer to NPCs than PCs. Oh sure, you can control them in battle, and occasionally have your PC influence them, but in the end their choices are dictated by the writers not the player. But yeah, you've got my main point. My question for you is, if the Warden becomes a companion do you think the player will be the one to make the Warden's decisions? Would he or she be almost like a second protagonist? Because I don't think that a) that's how Bioware would do it even if the decided to go that way (the Warden would probably just end up being like the other companions, or worse a really generic one that doesn't have real conversations- think Zaeed and Kasumi from ME2- to get around all the Wardeny differences), and b) that having two PCs or Protagonists or whatever you want to call them would work in a story-centric series like Dragon Age. Unless there were you ran two parallel stories...but then the Warden wouldn't really be a companion, but literally a second protagonist. I feel as though I may have gotten somewhat off topic by this point. Hmmm, No Hawke in DA3!!!--Liam Sionnach (talk) 04:12, August 22, 2012 (UTC)
@Liam Sionnach They are close to being NPCs, but they're not the same. I think we agree on that. If the Warden becomes a companion, will the player be the one to choose the responses? I think that's how it should be. Otherwise the Warden would just be silent the whole time. I suppose they could write lines for the Warden based on choices made in Origins, like whether you spared Avernus, and if so to do what; ethical research or the same old thing? Or like the slavers. Did the Warden side with them or not? In that case BioWare would probably have to make a patch for DA:O/A and DAII that records all those choices. Seems too involved. I'd say just let the player pick from a dialog list whenever the Warden must speak or respond. A second protag? In a way, sure, but little different from the other protag companions. The difference between the Warden and the main character in this hypothetical game would be that the main character never gets left in camp. The only problem here would be team chatter, or lack thereof. The Warden would not be able to do a back-and-forth like the other PCs without some AI. Here's a question. What if the Warden were like a PC that you got to make choices for, and then that choice would be carried out by the Warden leaving to accomplish it, then it goes back to the main character and that affects the storyline? Still, my ideal game would be for the Warden to be the main character and then the custom Hawke would be a companion. THAT character seems more suited to an AI build. Believe it! (talk) 18:06, August 22, 2012 (UTC)
Hawke is needed in DA3? Next thing I read is Cinderella needed in Call of Duty.
My whole point originally in bring up the conversation between Varrick and Cassandra, was that in doing so, Bio-ware has sort of committed them to bring Hawke in to Dragon Age III.
If I where they I might have the Dragon Age III story, start their first Chapter in-search for Hawke and the Warden, we do not know where they went, one glue might be near the end of Act 2, when Stroud says "they can not get involved, even if they wanted too, they have pressing matter's elsewhere". The second way is that know one truly knows the consequences of letting the "Architect" live. Thirdly maybe Hawke could be brought in; helping the Warden looking for Morrigan and child, that's another unfinished story, and What of Flemmeth, might she be interested in her grandchild, whom is part OLD GOD? There are just so many possibilities, but I know I do not want to see Allister, I killed him off in almost every play through Dragon Age Origins.
I also say we need some new races to possibly play, I am kinda "Tired" of playing a Human, Dwarf, or Elf. What about a member of the Kossith, possibly male or female, from the Qun or Tal-Vashoth, possibly a Sten, Avvarrad, or a Sarrabeth. What about playing an enlighten Dark Spawn "A Disciple", an Assassin, Blood-Mage, or some type of Fighter/Rogue.--Charlie.look (talk) 21:01, August 17, 2012 (UTC)
The biggest role I think they'll possibly give Hawke in DA3 will probably be quest giver. Even then they have to consider the custom faces and how they'd import, but it would make voice acting easier. When questioned as to why they aren't part of the fight they can answer "I was grievously wounded whilst fleeing Kirkwall, I'm no longer the warrior I was..." or something along that line. The mage Hawke could just say...well...they could just frown and say they are sick of Templars. This is why I'm not a writer. Hawke's character was very cookie-cutter and the companions of DA2 were akin to cardboard cut-outs. Honestly I don't care if Hawke comes back. As much as I would love my Warden to go adventuring again, I really don't want Bioware spitting on my Warden's choices. Please Bioware, just give us a good story and great characters.GoldenNightKnight (talk) 22:18, August 17, 2012 (UTC)
I've read many opinions regarding the Warden, Hawke and their appearance. Well, yes, there is the voice over problem about the Warden, and Hawke's personality as well (and noone mentioned the sex thing, I mean, are they male or female, there's plus work too) but consider that there are also mods which modify the game and their appearance. For example, I don't think they could import a save where the Champion and its family are in fact elves, or the Warden has colours and forms that are too different from the basic ones (blue, long hair, etc.). I think they need to reconsider if they really want to make our characters reappear if they haven't done already, no matter if they are companions or NPCs. But to eliminate this problem, they could use a sort of a messenger, a former companion, or something like that. The voices, the looks, the choices and the personalities and even (maybe) the mods cause too much trouble to make it right. --Margerard (talk) 22:42, August 17, 2012 (UTC)
Of course hawke should have some kind of role. Probably, as someone said, they aren't givin him the right one: too many complains from the fans on him, as ewe all can see. In my opinion,speaking about the plot da2 was just a big prelude to the third game, and Asunder seems to confirm that. So, hawke should be the pc of da3, eventually becoming what he was meant to be since the beginning. Kind of a worldwide hero, who decided the fate of the old chantry-mages-freedom question. But the reaction of most of us won't let it happen, as they hated him, probably because they hated the game he was the protagonist of. And I don't really understand why we always want to be the one who save the all world. We don't really want another blight, do we? Its not possible, the dark spawn is definitely non ready. The Templar-Mage is just fine, considering its really messing up all the world at the moment. And it's something I've never seen in a game, far more deeper than just saving the world. Quiteoriginal. Hawke is A good one. Ill give him another try. Cause of course, I loved the idea of the second, but well we all know how it ended. Hope to have been clear, English is not my mother tongue.--Khilratyisback (talk) 09:23, August 18, 2012 (UTC)
- The problem with Hawke is that they were probably just trying to make DA2 one big Origin, but their advertisment was selling it as a big and normal game. They wanted to create one game, cut it into pieces and charging us for each piece the price of the whole set. I have considered several events to deduce this; like how rushed it was - as little content as possible (as long as it takes you some time to beat it), or that it ended with a cliffhanger, or that it didn't really answer any lore questions - and added more, etc etc. Henio0 (talk) 18:43, August 18, 2012 (UTC)
Didnt the chantry only want to find Hawke because she/he has already picked a side so they can come back and join whichever side they support?And i dunno i guess i liked my hawke but i have to agree that he/she didnt make much of a diffrence.I want an ending for my Hawke but if the ending is gonna be terrible then i dunno just let Hawke vanish, let the FANS guess what their Hawke is up to :3.