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Dragon Age's Religion is vast and has quite a numerous differences between races. I was wondering how they all interact with each other because there is elvish gods and yet the maker.


Simple, we no proof that there is any Maker nor for that matter that the elven gods really were gods. Caspoi (talk) 19:03, January 29, 2015 (UTC)


Some players believe Flemeth is a reincarnation of Andraste and Solas a reincarnation of Shartan. We know that the witch is possessed by Mythal and Solas by Fen'Harel. Some players believe Fen'Harel was the Maker Andraste spoke to. After revelation that Ren'Harel's domain is rebellion, it would make sense. I also heard theory that the archdemons are the forgotten ones in Dalish myths. As Caspoi mentioned nothing proves if they are really gods. Flemeth suggested Mythal could be something more. I would say something less, because nothing is greater than a god. I just believe Mythal and Fen'Harel are ones of the most powerful spirits.

The dwarven notion of the Stone doesn't contradict the idea that a creator might have created the Stone itself. Dwarves just don't believe that, but it doesn't make it true. Some theoretised that the Stone is a some kind of lyrium. I have own theory that lyrium comes from stone as it's core. Lyrium is alive, I believe it's a plant powered by souls of dead dwarves. The dwarves themselves believe that spirits of dead dwarves return to the stone and strengthen the foundations of Orzammar. Dwarven souls can be all portions of same powerful spirit that became lyrium. Burring dwarves make the lyrium restore by sending their soul.

Only thing qunari have in common with human religion is Fade as their land of dead.Andrzej.lewinski.351 (talk) 19:15, January 29, 2015 (UTC)

The Qunari don't have a "religion". It's more of a philosophy. And we don't know the beliefs of those Thedosian Qunari left behind. It is known they had entirely different beliefs, so.

Anyway, I'm of the belief that follows all the beliefs. As Solas explains, I don't believe the "ancient elven gods" were actually gods. They were just very powerful being unlike mortals or spirits, but something greater entirely. I do believe in the great possibility that the Maker exists as a god, and that all those "elven gods" lived below him. The elves worshipped these "elven deities" because they spoke to the elves and taught them all they needed to know to thrive. They knew they were powerful and were wise, so they'd obviously worship these creatures as gods. They wouldn't turn to the Maker because the Maker spoke to them. They didn't have contact with the Maker like the "elven gods" did. I believe the Old Gods are likely the Forgotten Ones. Tevinter would worship these because the ancient magisters supposedly communicated with them as well. AFreeMarcher (talk) 00:33, January 30, 2015 (UTC)

The fact that everything has been left so open-ended has actually been irking me since I got into DA, and has only increased rather than being assuaged due to the amount of foreshadowing, hinting and other literary attempts that seem to have ended up going nowhere or never being elaborated upon again. Anyway, I suppose I'll begin with the Maker. The Chantry claims He created the universe and everything in it, and as such, is fully within his power to manipulate as He wills. However, when things appear to not go *His* way, instead of simply changing reality to suit His whim, His reaction is to either A) to lock his rivals away in eternal prisons and then leave or B) just leave. Which begs the question of why He'd even create rivals for himself if He knows it'll just result in that anyway? The same goes for whether or not the 'elven gods' fall under His dominion. It just doesn't add up to the Maker being any more than a jealous, cranky individual who repeatedly screws Himself over with His own lack of foresight; and frankly, I think He ceased to matter the moment He left, because no god who so lightly abandons their duties should ever be worthy of respect. Now, onto the elven 'deities'. This situation is being left painfully ambiguous. First, the lore hints at them *never* being able to interact with the mortal realm, and then we find out Mythal has been tooling around for the past few centuries (in a *human* body, no less). I find it reeeeally difficult to imagine them as merely powerful spirits who have attained a level of personality that extends being a single aspect which the grander majority of spirits appear incapable of. After all, should the story behind the Varterral be true, I cannot honestly say I can imagine a spirit creating such a being; it's been noted more than once that spirits are capable only of mimicking the ability to create, not bring new things into reality of their own will, so unless that's changed, I don't know what to say. The Qunari, as noted by FreeMarcher above, have no true 'religion' anymore than a philosophy; they appear to find the supernatural distasteful at best. The dwarves venerate rocks, which I suppose is understandable. Whether their spirits truly enter their Stone when they die.. well crazier stuff might exist. On the Old Gods, I highly doubt they're divine beings. Dragons in many fantasy settings are often capable of speech, intelligence and displaying powerful magical talent. I see no reason why such a situation cannot apply to them as well, without all the 'god' crap. But it still begs the question of why they're buried and imprisoned. It'd take something very strong to subdue and imprison every single one of them and keep them that way for hundreds or even thousands of years, but there's not a single, solid piece of evidence as to what or why. All in all, many questions, zero answers; and the latter does not appear forthcoming at any point in the foreseeable future. EzzyD (talk) 11:00, January 30, 2015 (UTC)

I've never believed the elven dieties couldn't interact with the mortal world. Everything we know and learned about them states otherwise. Just look at the Elven pantheon page. The whole story of Falon'din tells otherwise, same as Andruil and Fen'Harel. Sylaise taught the ancient elves fire, weaving, and herbalism. June taught the elves crafting. Ghilan'nain was a mortal originally, until she caught the sight of Andruil, saved her from death, and ascended to god-hooded. Mythal was murdered and reduced to a whisp before she found Flemeth. I think where ever the "couldn't interact with the mortal world" originated was wrong, mistaken, or misinterpreted. Cause everything in DA lore and the games have contradicted that. Now, I don't believe they lived in the mortal world, of course. They lived in an unknown realm. They could use the Fade to interact with mortals, and could possess mortals to interact with the mortal world. Solas shows that they don't even need possession, but possibly possessing a fetus much in the way the Archdemon's soul was able to possess Morrigan's baby before it was born.
Also, at Caspoi, we do have proof that the elven gods weren't really gods. Two of them tell us that they aren't.AFreeMarcher (talk) 23:24, January 31, 2015 (UTC)
Solas says so as "Solas" so this does not prove anything and I don't remember any other occasion were an elven god says so. Caspoi (talk) 12:40, February 1, 2015 (UTC)
...You do realize Solas is Fen'Harel, right? He is very aware of his existence and what he is, same as Mythal/Flemeth. AFreeMarcher (talk) 01:11, February 2, 2015 (UTC)
Yes but he could also be lying. In fact he 'is lying on the subject of the elven gods seeing as he never reveals his true identity. Caspoi (talk) 01:06, February 3, 2015 (UTC)
I find myself hoping they don't explain anything with the various religions. Religion is one of the driving forces of the DA 'verse, and for the devs to suddenly say "this one's right, everyone else is dumb, nyah-nyah" would be a kick in the balls the setting would never recover from. The mysterious nature of the Maker and the elven gods is what makes the "religion in Thedas" issue so compelling, just like religion in real life. On a lesser note, Bioware writing the big reveal tends to be a disappointment when they hype something as ancient and mysterious and then go ahead and tell you what it is (the Reapers going from being "eldritch nightmares with unknowable goals" to "meat slurry harvester 'bots commanded by an AI with badly-coded programming" being a prime example here), so I'm going to end by saying I hope they just leave the religion issue up to interpretation. --DavetheExile (talk) 13:50, February 1, 2015 (UTC)

i didn't think the religions were connected in any way.Here are my theories (SPOILERS)

Tevinter Old Gods: we have proof that the old gods existed in one form or another, at least as incredibaly powerful dragons. Otherwise a normal high dragon could start a blight. These dragons were dormant before humanity arrived in Thedas, during the time of Elvhenan. The Old gods are male, with is unusual for dragons in Thedas as male dragons can only become drakes. My theory is that the Old gods were seven powerful dragons, maybe drakes that were experimented on by the ancient elves, that terrorised Elvhenan. The old gods either had the power to possess normal drakes at death like archdemons, or were to powerful to be killed, so the ancient elves contained them underground. As the millenia passed, the humans arrived in Thedas and the Old Gods contacted the Neromenian Dreamer, who relied on their knowledge to build their civilisations. eventually this eveolved into worship of the Old Gods. A few centuries down, the Old Gods contact Corypheus and his collegues and tell them to enter the Black/Golden City, so they can gain the power to free the Old Gods. This, naturally went horribly wrong, resulting in the darkspawn, who, ironically, are compelled to free the Old Gods resulting in the Archdemons and the Blights. Sadly this is my most coherent theory

Dwarven Stone:As there are no written records before the contruction of Arlathan, whether the dawrves or elves are native to Thedas is unknown. Infact, as far as I can tell, there are no records of dwarves until there alliance with Tevinter. What we do know is that Kal-Sharok, the original capital of the Dwarven Empire, is deep underground, as is Bartrand's Folly Thaig, which predated the Dwarven Empire. Now this will sound really shitty, and probably insulting, but I think the dwarven veneration of the Stone started as a simple wish for the thaigs' ceiling not to fall on top of them, the "Stone" above and around them(obvious I know but bare with me). then came the discovery of Lyrium, among other metals, but Lyrium being the most important, as it is "the Gift from the Stone".

The Qun: As mentioned by AFreeMarcher and EzzyD, The Qun is not actually a religion, but a cult philosophy similar to a form communism, where every person has a role, and everything belongs to the community. The only exception is the mages, who are reduced into mindless slaves. The Qunari, or Kossith(I'll use this for a lack of a better term) have landed in Thedas twice, once before the first blight, predating the Qun, and the mass exodus of the Qunari. The former sounds like a simple colony in a new continent. the latter, however, sounds like the Qunari were running from something. With no knowledge of the old homeland of the kossith, my theory is that Koslun start his Qun cult, attracting thousands, and is branded a heretic. Koslun takes his people across the sea to Thedas.

Elven Parthenon: To me, the Elven gods sound similar to the gods of ancient Egypt, who could possess mortals to impose their will on the mortal world. This explains the whole Flemeth/Mythal thing. The only exception is Fen'Harel, who seemed to be mortal, as I don't think Solas was possessed by Fen'harel, but an elf from before the arrival of the humans and the "Quickening". My theory is that Fen'Harel was a powerful mage in Elvhenan who was angry with the order that Elgar'nan imposed in the elves, or maybe the inference of both the Creators or the Forgotten ones in the mortal world, and fought a war, the war that started the fall of Elvhenan, and maybe the creation of the Old Gods(the only plausible connection with my theories of the origin of religions). The aftermath of this war saw only a weakened Fen'harel and the weakened form of Mythal left on Thedas. Fen'harel entered a deep sleep to regain his energies, and Mythal roamed Thedas until she encountered Flemeth.

The chantry: I don't actually believe that there was a maker, as the concept of the Maker leaving his creation twice sounds like a little kid ragequitting someone knocked over his block tower. I also think that Andraste was a mage like the Imperial Chantry beleives. I beleive that Andraste was contacted by a spirit in the Fade, maybe one of Faith or Compassion, that she believed was the make of the universe(sounds harsh but the Venatori believed that Corypheus was a god so its possible). As Andraste's war failed, the same spirit convince Archon Hessarian to end Andraste's torment in the fire. Drakon and the First Iquistion then misinterpreted the story to create the Maker.

Those are my theories at least, probably filled with gaps in knowledge and filled with bias. Mangelator1 (talk) 14:15, January 30, 2015 (UTC)


Based on what has been presented so far in the games, I think that all of the religions are at least partially correct, all of them are compatible, and none of them are 100% "right".

The Qunari abhor all things supernatural. They do not worship anything. They venerate Koslun, but he was a just mortal Qunari, and the Qunari themselves don't see him as anything else. No gods here.

The dwarves worship the stone. As in, literally the ground itself. They personify to some extent, but it is not a "god" in the way as the Old Gods or the Elven Pantheon are. Obviously the ground exists. Whether or not lyrium or some other force gives it some kind of sentience is up for debate, but it is not meant to be a being with a personality like the elven gods or the Maker.

The Old Gods are obviously real, and we've known this since Origins. They are super-powerful, magical male high dragons at the very least. Is that enough to make them "gods"? I think that any being of sufficient power can rightly call itself a god, and the Old Gods clearly meet the minimum qualifications for godhood, if nothing more.

SPOILER ALERT

Mythal and Fen'Harel are real, and I think it's safe to assume that the other elven gods are real or were real at some point. Again, the issue is "are they gods?" Well, they were/are extremely powerful beings that were/are worshiped. What else does something need to be a god? Their true nature might be ancient elven nobles who were powerful mages, or they might be spirit-like beings (not actual spirits) who took the form of elves (among other things). Either way, they exist/existed and were/are worshiped. Do they need to have the tag "gods" in the game code to be gods or something?

Oh, and the Maker = Elgar'nan. Think about it. Silver Warden (talk) 01:45, February 2, 2015 (UTC)

Why would the Maker be Elgar'nan? Caspoi (talk) 01:06, February 3, 2015 (UTC)
They are both sun gods, they have both left their worshipers, and both are based on the god of the abrahamic religions. The Maker is based on the "new testament" version, while Elgar'nan appears to be more "old testament", which fits the Christian/Jewish themes of the Andrastian and Dalish religions.
The name Elgar'nan is probably inspired from Elohim (a Hebrew name for god), which is the singular/plural form of the Canaanite god El. The god El was eventually merged with the god Yahweh and evolved into the concept of the abrahamic god that is worshiped by the abrahamic religions today.
The similarities between the Elgar'nan/Maker and the Old Testament/New Testament dichotomies, combined with the Dalish/Andrastrian and Jewish/Christian themes are too much to overlook. Add to that the sun motif, and it's pretty clear that there's some connection between the two. I'd be more surprised if they didn't turn out to be the same god, it just makes too much sense for them not to be. Silver Warden (talk) 14:58, February 3, 2015 (UTC)
The Maker has been stated to represent faith in the DA universe, and as faith is believing in something despite there being no evidence for it, I don't believe His existence will be either confirmed or denied. As at least two of the Elven gods do exist, Elgar'nan almost certainly does, meaning his being the Maker is extremely unlikely. Also, later religions adopting the symbols and trappings of the earlier ones is quite common, and this even happens in the Dragon Age universe itself. Many of the holidays currently celebrated by Andrastians were originally holidays dedicated to the Old Gods of Tevinter. Further, the idea of the Sun as a holy symbol is a very widespread one, given its importance to life, the numerous sun gods scattered across numerous civilizations separated by both distance and time being proof of this. Finally, Elgar'nan didn't create the world, as the Chantry claims the Maker did. He only reshaped it after fighting with his Father, the Sun. In fact, if there is any area for the Maker in the Elven Pantheon, it's as the Sun in that legend. Your humble Magister, TheFereldenMagister (talk) 06:28, March 17, 2015 (UTC)
"later religions adopting the symbols and trappings of the earlier ones is quite common, and this even happens in the Dragon Age universe itself" (TheFereldenMagister) And that is what I think happened. The Dalish legend of Elgar'nan fighting the sun is unlikely to be 100% correct, given that they were wrong about so many other things. But they are probably closer to the truth than anyone else. However, it's unlikely that Elgar'nan will be equated with the Maker out loud on screen. After all, Andrastians would deny it even if Elgar'nan arrived in the flesh to tell them. Silver Warden (talk) 14:37, March 17, 2015 (UTC)
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